hemi cuda question

[jim picanzo]

any ballpark idea what a rebodied hemi cuda might be worth?no drivetrain,but fender tag dash vin and clean titile but original car wrecked now on a rough 70 cuda..any advice on a price ballpark?

 

[SFEbody]

Pictures will help, every car is different, but IMO, it can me very valuable no matter.

 

[70chall440]

"rebodied"?? I believe that it is a federal offense to remove the VIN and put it onto another car. I suspect this thread is going to get a bit ugly pretty quick especially since this is a Hemi VIN you are talking about. This is a pretty touchy subject to say the least, hell people get super upset when the subject of getting a fender tag made, I think they will go ape crap crazy over a VIN being changed over to a different car.

Back in the 40s and made the 50s I think "rebodying" cars was a thing but not in the 60s definitely not in the 70s because car theft and forgery were big deals.

As to value, well that is very debatable but all things considered it should be on par with a 318 car with a transplanted Hemi I would think.

 

[70chall440]

After rereading your post, you are talking about buying a VIN tag and title and putting them onto a "donor" car? Umm definitely might want to look at federal statues about that one... Maybe its ok, but I don't think so. In most arenas that stuff would be "garage art" to be framed and hung up, building a car with it I think would only lead to a lot of pain bc the Hemi community is relatively small and the word would go out pretty quickly I think.

 

[jim picanzo]

all original paperwork and tags,nothing reproduced.car was wrecked.dynacorn would be out of buseness if bodys werent used to replace wrecked or rotted cars and never would it be anything BUT rebodied.everyone jumps to conclusioj of some kind of fraud,casr is too far gone to use with rot and damage,

 

[Adam]

A lot depends on what state you are in. In Calif you cannot attach a vin to a different body, you could repair the wrecked body with new parts. If the car has a “salvage title” it will require an inspection from the Ca. Highway Patrol; if they cannot confirm the numbers they can “blue tag“ it (assign a new vin) and rivet it to the door jamb. If they suspect the numbers have been altered, or removed and replaced, they can, and likely will, seize the car.

In Washington State they do not allow salvaged cars, period. But you can construct a new car with a Dynacorn body and the state will assign a vin to it. This vin will not match the original, the car would be a 2021, and I think you will have to comply with modern smog standards

 

[moparleo]

You can't transfer VIN....Vehicle Identification Number.
It would be on non replaceable chassis components Cowl, radiator support. etc... depending on the car.
A reproduction body would be that. A body. Not a vehicle. Like a fender would be a replacement par, but would not get a VIN.
It would be a new production body with a non factory VIN. Only the original mfg could assign a Factory vin.
The VIN was a factory certification that the completed car met all Federal safety standards and regulations.
Just like what was said about a salvage title. Its purpose is to that the car might not meet Federal safety standards anymore and the mfg could not be held liable for any failures. This drastically lowers the value of the car. Only driver value now.
Like a taking a Cobra kit car and trying to put an original VIN plate on it.
What would be the point of trying to use an old VIN plate, I.D. on a reproduction body unless you were trying to represent is as such ? If not, then the original VIN should not matter to you.
The vin plate on the dash would not be enough to legally id a car. It must have numbers on the chassis/structure as well.

 

[jim picanzo]

so if cowl numbers rotted,unreadable and rad support also rotted and bent thats it,car cannot be reapaired with all new metal???that what your telling me??????

 

[challenger6pak]

Has the Cuda been rebodied? Are you wanting to do the rebody? Is the wrecked original Cuda still together with numbers etc?

 

[jim picanzo]

Has the Cuda been rebodied? Are you wanting to do the rebody? Is the wrecked original Cuda still together with numbers etc?

Has not been rebodied.rotted wrecked piece of non useable junk.

 

[Cuda416]

all original paperwork and tags,nothing reproduced.car was wrecked.dynacorn would be out of buseness if bodys werent used to replace wrecked or rotted cars and never would it be anything BUT rebodied.everyone jumps to conclusioj of some kind of fraud,casr is too far gone to use with rot and damage,

I can guarantee you Dynacorns business model is not for rebodying cars to false vins.

Many states require you to get a new vin for those cars and they are often considered "kit cars". I have never heard of any case in which moving a vin from one body to another is legal. In CO, where they to a vin verification, they check "all the places" for various forms of the VIN. That's what they did when I brought my cuda into the state. They don't play around due to a history of "chop shops".

There are grey areas depending on who you talk to but the end result is always, don't do it, or do it it and never ever try to sell it claiming it's an original HEMI car... document everything and save the original parts of the car with the vin portions stamped. To not do so would be misrepresentation and will land you in very hot water. Whatever you may think of it, doesn't matter when someone comes after you with a very expensive lawyer.

 

[jim picanzo]

i have never suggested trying to fool anyone ever,i simply asked what a rebody hemi car is worth knowing its a rebody,

 

[Cuda416]

i have never suggested trying to fool anyone ever,i simply asked what a rebody hemi car is worth knowing its a rebody,

Yup, I know, but often times these conversations end up being about that so I got it out of the way.

If there's not intent to "fool" then you don't need the hemi vin for anything other than a cool wall ornament. Take the rest of the hemi stuff off the original car, build cool clone and leave the VIN alone. There is no question then about what the car is.

 

[Chryco Psycho]

This is such a grey area , You can replace the floors , rockers , frame rails , roof , wheel houses , rad wall , all exterior body panels & still have a real car but start with a dynacorn body & swap the cowl & rad support & it is a rebody .

 

[Cuda416]

This is such a grey area , You can replace the floors , rockers , frame rails , roof , wheel houses , rad wall , all exterior body panels & still have a real car but start with a dynacorn body & swap the cowl & rad support & it is a rebody .

I think ultimately it comes down to intent and affect. Regardless of the intent, it ruins the originality of the "donor" and reduces the value of legit cars. These cares were never meant to last this long. That's part of the mystique about them. When they are "restored", then there are the same number of cars. If one gets crushed lets say, well, that car is dead. It is no more.

even the guy who makes the e-body conversions doesn't claim they are true verts. The Vins are not changed and often times you have to know what you're looking for (other then the vin) to tell it's "fake" but they don't devalue my car because they aren't true verts. They are clones and claimed as such.

 

[Cuda416]

Another problem i see, is regardless of OP's intent, who knows what will happen down the road. He could "rebody" the VIN, then sell it as such. Maybe that's legit maybe it's not, but if he discloses is, lets assume it's legit. The next guy, can easily pass if off as a real hemi car that's had extensive work. The grey area becomes a whole mess at that point. Third person in line thinks they just paid a quarter mill on a true hemi car that started off the line as such.

 

[Challenger RTA]

I'm going to sit around the fire ring and watch the flames.
I'll throw a log on latter.

 

[SFEbody]

if it's a true hemi car, wouldn't that be listed on galen glover historic list?

 

[70chall440]

There are a lot of reasons someone can use for/against, however at the end of the day it comes down to legality. Sure you can use a Dynacorn body (BTW they don't make a Cuda) and build it into whatever you want, but as stated it will have its own unique VIN. Also, you can rebuild/replace pretty much everything on an original car and have it considered to be "real".

I have argued exactly the point you are trying to make from a theoretical stand point a number of times. If Hemi cars were not collector's items and bringing so much money this probably would not be near the deal it is. All of these cars started life exactly the same and at some point coming down the line they became whatever they became, so if you had a unusable Hemi car or 6 pack car and a really nice 318 car you would think that you could make one really nice car out of the two, but because there is money and value involved plus federal and state statutes/rules/laws/regulations you can't.

As the saying goes, "don't hate the player, hate the game"....

 

[heminut]

Back when I was still active in law enforcement I took a class on stolen vehicles. The instructor (a Federal Agent) told us that all U.S. made cars had the V.I.N. stamped somewhere on the frame or unibody that was not disclosed to the general public. He claimed that he could tell if a car had been 'rebadged' and if he found one that had, it was automatically seized and usually destroyed. I certainly wouldn't risk putting my money into that kind of endeavor!